Body modification, Plastic surgery, Etc...

[IslandSteveZ]

The other night I was watching an episode of the TV show “Taboo” on the National Geographic channel. The show was about ways that different cultures modify their appearance in the pursuit of beautification. It reminded me of another show that I had seen a couple weeks ago called “Perfect Private Parts” on BBC America. That show predictably dealt with plastic surgery used to change the appearance of the genitals and specifically in women through procedures such as vaginoplasty (reshaping and or tightening of the vagina), and labioplasty (reduction, reshaping, evening of the labia minora/majora). They made a point of commenting on how in the U.K. there are girls as young as 16 seeking labioplasty surgeries. I have heard stories of girls much younger seeking various plastic surgeries for everything from facial changes to breast implants. A great deal of the show was dedicated to exploring the pressures placed on women by the media as well as perceived pressures from other women to look the same. 

This of course got me to thinking about the extremes people will go to in order to “fit in” with society. We have all seen our fair share of debates around here as well as on other forums regarding body modification and its place in naturism. There’s got to be at least half a dozen threads on here about pubic hair styles alone, (no I didn’t look to count them). Of course there are the debates over tattoos, piercing, and pretty much everything else under the sun.

So, I’d like to know what this group thinks about all this. How do you feel about body modification for aesthetic reasons and how do you feel that it fits in with a naturist lifestyle? When do you feel that plastic surgery is acceptable and when is it unacceptable? At what age do you think it is appropriate for a person to delve into body modification of any sort? In your opinion what level of body modification is “Okay”? 

[Professor]

I don’t think its okay that insecure people can mutilate themselves instead of getting therapy or addressing their self esteem. I have heard of a couple cases where guys got their penis utterly destroyed because their enlargement surgery went wrong. I don’t know what it says about people that their first inclination is to go under the knife. So many difficulties can be corrected with diet and exercise.

Plastic surgery is appropriate when it applies to people who were disfigured or injured in some manner, but when people are just insecure I think it is being abused. If you have ever seen a botched boob job or face job would agree this is not the answer. Which also begs the question who decided what is the standard of beauty we should all fit anyway?

I think its great when somebody corrects a facial deformity, like when some kids don’t have a full upper lip. But wrong when vain people want their lips to be like angelina jolies.

As per tattoos, piercing, ritual scarring, etc. Each to their own. Nobody or no body is more human than another. Those things are not my cup of tea, nor would I look for them in a mate. Though I would not hesitate to befriend someone who had them if their personality was cool. It’s the same with body hair.  Its okay to shave, or let hair grow. I’m tired people saying its more natural to be whatever is they happen to be. I think if you are healthy you will be beautiful regardless and there is so much beauty in diversity.
 

[IslandSteveZ]

Thanks professor, I was beginning to think that this may have been to heavy of a subject...

[AndrewH]

I believe in being all natural when it comes to nudism (pubic hair styles, body paint, etc.). At the end of the day, it just feels right.

When it comes to plastic surgery, I think it's just wrong that teenage girls and other children are having it done. If kids my age are feeling that much pressure to be "beautiful" and to "fit in" with society, then society has gotten its priorities severely out of whack!

[ChristineF]

As young as 16?????? What ever happened to parental consent????? 

[Baseballfan]

As young as 16?????? What ever happened to parental consent????? 

apparently it doesn't exist in England/Brittan/UK ??

[rc]

I think parent constent happens in the UK I think they with today's generation there is just a young crowd that wants to be hip and do plastic surgery

[Professor]

What about other deformities that may or may not be as visible or noticeable? Would surgery in a case like that be acceptable?

Plastic surgery definitely has a place in the world. The contention is that it is not a perfected thing and that there should be checks and balances to prevent the abuse of this technology by those who don’t really need it or by those just out to make money and exploit insecure people.

Back in the day people used to use wooden teeth after their real ones had fallen out. (like George Washington) so people will improve their lives if they can.

[IslandSteveZ]

As young as 16?????? What ever happened to parental consent????? 

Christine, I believe that in most parts of the UK 16 is considered age of majority and therefore parental consent is not required. I could be mistaken about that though. In some cases of young people seeking cosmetic surgery that I have seen, the parents are all for it. I read an article a few years ago regarding a girl who was I believe around 12 seeking surgery to even out her breasts that had begun to develop unevenly. I'm sure most people are aware that women's breasts tend to be naturally a bit uneven and I guess in this case it was a bit more pronounced than normal however at 12 years old the breasts normally haven't fully developed. That made me wonder what doctor in his right mind or with proper motivation would actually go through with a surgery that may not even be a problem in a year or two. What it came down to was that the girl had been suffering "severe" ridicule from classmates regarding her uneven development and some quack psychologist convinced her parents that surgery may be the right choice. The reasoning for the girls seeking genital surgery in the TV show was pretty much the same. They pointed out cases of girls feeling awkward or being "picked on" in the locker room due to prominent labia.

[Noodie]

As young as 16?????? What ever happened to parental consent????? 

Christine, I believe that in most parts of the UK 16 is considered age of majority and therefore parental consent is not required. I could be mistaken about that though.

For most purposes, it's 18. You'd be considered an adult at 18 and be able to vote, drink, etc. The 'age of consent' for sex is 16 though (for both heterosexuals and homsexuals now - used to be 18 for homosexual men until 2003)

Consent for medical treatment isn't really that straightforward though.

Basically, you are assumed to be legally competent to give consent once you turn 16, but this is a rebuttable presumption. The Department of Health still recommends that it is nevertheless good practice to encourage children of this age to involve their families in decisions about their care, unless it would not be in their interests to do so.

If the child is under 16, they are assumed not to be legally competent but, again, this is a rebuttable presumption. A child under 16 can still establish competency through the rule in Gillick v West Norfolk & Wisbech Health Authority. That case established a number of questions that have to be asked, but it basically boils down to the risks, complexity, and potential consequences of surgery (it is much more likely that a child will be held capable of consenting to a relatively straightforward procedure) and factors such as age, level of education, and the information made available by the surgeon. For the most part, parents cannot override the wishes of a competent child and confidentiality must also be respected in such circumstances. However, a child aged 16-18 cannot refuse treatment if it has been agreed by a person with parental responsibility, or by a court, and it is in their best interests.

If that sounds a bit complicated, trust me, it's actually an over-simplification!

On the main issue though:

I think it's very sad that people - especially young people - feel so pressured to conform to a template that they consider such extreme measures. The concept of a singular definition of beauty is rather an odd one.